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Post by timothylane on Nov 18, 2019 21:43:27 GMT -8
I guess that's the Muslim version of lese majeste.
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Post by kungfuzu on Nov 18, 2019 21:51:54 GMT -8
"The Age of Faith"
While it is true that Jews in Moslem Spain did relatively well for some centuries, the actual history is less rosy than the myth one still hears from some Jews today. In general, the Jews were able to maneuver through some less than ideal times with periods of good and bad relations between them and the majority populations.
Durant writes;
The law against employing a Jewish physician was particularly stupid as they and some Moslems were the best medics of the age.
Historically speaking, it is hard to go wrong by betting men will end up being vicious to each other.
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Post by timothylane on Nov 18, 2019 22:04:09 GMT -8
Barbara Hambly has a series of mysteries involving a free black in antebellum New Orleans who was trained as a physician in Paris. Of course no white would agree to be his patient. One of them features Jefferson Davis, who takes the view that a master ought to be able to trust his slave.
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Post by kungfuzu on Nov 27, 2019 20:39:01 GMT -8
"The Age of Faith" by Will Durant
Over the last three years, in its debate on Brexit, the U.K. Parliament has reached some new lows. I thought it might be worthwhile to go back and refresh our history on the law and Parliament.
Durant writes;
and how Edward I
Oh well things developed nicely and peaked about 100 years back. Today the British Parliament has shown itself to be as big a joke as our Congress.
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Post by Brad Nelson on Nov 28, 2019 9:11:03 GMT -8
The Marxist rot is deep. Hopefully England can find its way back. Speaking of which...in dramatic productions they are suffering as well. The once excellent "The Crown" series has been emasculated by a total recasting of the major roles.
Olivia Colman — who was serviceable in Broadchurch — is awful as Queen Elizabeth II. Why they couldn't have just aged the excellent Claire Foy is beyond me. The spreading disease of something inflicts the British.
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Post by kungfuzu on Dec 2, 2019 19:41:37 GMT -8
"The Age of Faith" by Will Durant
One thing which stands out about pre-Renaissance and Renaissance Italy is the constant violence which plagued the country. Cities fought other cities, guilds other guilds, families other families. It is no wonder that the peninsula was finally subdued by the French and Spanish who brought a little more order to the common people.
That being said, Durant has a very good insight into a basic fault of many historians.
One will do well to remember that the same sentiment applies to our times as well.
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Post by kungfuzu on Dec 2, 2019 19:57:39 GMT -8
"The Age of Faith"
During the 12th and 13th centuries, the Church came close to a unified Europe as existed since the days of Rome. From its beginnings, the Church was universalist and once it became the official religion of the Empire it fit right in with the idea of empire. It was not concerned with nations or nation states, in fact it abhorred the development of the nation state. The Church viewed all of Christendom, at least Western Christendom after the great schism in 1154, as its realm. It could be said that the Church developed the most international of laws, since Justinian. Durant writes, The present Marxist posing as pope likes to try and use the same universalism to his ideas on nations states. Again, there are certain themes in history which return again and again.
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Post by timothylane on Dec 2, 2019 20:02:55 GMT -8
Italy was divided into city-states. The same sort of problems also occurred in Germany at the time, as they had previously in classical Greece. Note that during the Archidamian War, the Spartans would invade Attica each year, forcing the whole population behind the walls of Athens-Piraeus, and burn a district out.
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Post by kungfuzu on Dec 2, 2019 20:14:54 GMT -8
"The Age of Faith"
One of the strangest things about this period is the fanaticism which ruled the minds of many. Durant gives an example in Elizabeth of Thuringa (1207-31). Shortly after this passage, Durant puts the Church's role in some perspective which is today forgotten by the leftists and rabid atheists who have no understanding of history. The leftists have lost their belief and are trying to weld it into a syncretic belief in which the State is the Church. But they are still insane.
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Post by kungfuzu on Dec 2, 2019 20:27:11 GMT -8
Such problems occur throughout history. Small independent polities, begin to fight with each other and have internal splits. These virtually always lead to a weakened state which is conquered by larger unified states less interested in political discourse and individual freedom. This is one of the main reasons libertarians are pissing in the wind. At no time in history has any state lasted for an extended period of time without the unity of purpose imposed by a predominant culture and law and order, i.e. force. And where the culture is not strong enough, force will have the upper hand. Left to their own unrestrained devices, men will inevitably screw things up and leave themselves prey to an organized and more ruthless force.
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Post by timothylane on Dec 2, 2019 20:38:44 GMT -8
Those are very interesting reports on the role of religion and the Church. I already knew that the alleged Church hostility to science has been considerably exaggerated. And note that if no ecclesiastical court could inflict the death penalty, then the Spanish and Papal Inquisitions had to be secular courts (as was certainly the case at the witchcraft trials in Salem and probably elsewhere). Perhaps they turned confessed prisoners over to secular authorities for sentencing. Certainly they had a form of due process of law, though nothing we would approve of today. (But neither did secular courts.)
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Post by kungfuzu on Dec 2, 2019 20:42:44 GMT -8
"The Age of Faith"
I found Durant's summation of the Church during this period interesting.
Without the Church, there would have been no Western Civilization as we know it.
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Post by Brad Nelson on Dec 3, 2019 19:48:36 GMT -8
It’s interesting, because one could say that Christianity was organizing society along a moral center and the various modern forms of anti-Christianity are aligning along economic ones. The greatest sin is not murder but poverty.
Of course, how ghastly to see large swaths of Christianity and Judaism taking on the economic orientation.
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Post by kungfuzu on Dec 3, 2019 20:16:17 GMT -8
"The Age of Faith"
Durant lays out the best short description I have ever read of human nature and why societies emerged, how human nature demanded curbing and why God is necessary. We have covered all of this before at ST and here, but Durant's presentation is brief, brilliant and beautiful.
For anyone who knows human nature or history, the above should perfectly reasonable. The fools or scoundrels of the left and libertarians deny all history and nature. Should mankind follow their dishonest or idiotic creeds, nothing but pain, blood and destruction will follow.
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Post by timothylane on Dec 3, 2019 20:20:12 GMT -8
Or as Edward Rutledge sings in "Molasses to Rum to Slaves" from 1776: "Molasses to rum to slaves, 'tisn't morals, 'tis money, that saves. Shall we dance to the sound of a profitable pound in molasses and rum and slaves?" That song, with its evisceration of Yankee hypocrisy, is the main reason I got the soundtrack. (In the end it criticizes all involved. "Mr. Adams, I give you a toast. Hail Boston. Hail Charleston. Who stink the most?")
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Post by kungfuzu on Dec 3, 2019 20:29:20 GMT -8
You have very good timing and insight. I was writing my long post quoting Durant on society as you posted the above.
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Post by Brad Nelson on Dec 4, 2019 8:30:20 GMT -8
The problem with this view is that it is exactly like the “just-so” stories of Darwinism. Not all humans lived in the jungle. Not all were scrambling for food. Northwest Indians, by and large, had an abundant supply of food. In fact, we can’t say for sure how the first humans lived. We suppose they “evolved” somehow in Africa. But sifting through bones of obviously (to me) non-human species and pretending that they are our immediate ancestors has produced no insights.
Many of these ideas are certainly plausible. A tree will produce millions of seeds in hopes that even one or two will become a tall tree. And for most species to survive, they need not be sexual unless the female is fertile. Humanity’s readiness for sex, anytime anywhere, is somewhat of an anomaly. The rest of nature does not follow suit.
The fact is, we don’t know why human nature is what it is. Was there a fall in the Garden of Eden? What we do know is that embedded in man’s nature, and facilitated by nature itself, is a propensity toward cruelty, violence, dishonesty, greed, sexual promiscuity, injustice, and dishonor.
The idea of a God of Judgment, of a Divine Source that must be active in our conscience when we act, is becoming an outdated and certainly unfashionable notion. I mean, maybe my friend, JB, is correct that the old trope of “hope of heaven/fear of hell” is wrong and we will all be saved. Maybe a God of moral judgment is not necessary in order for humans to climb above their nature.
The hope of today is the if you love-bomb people enough with “acceptance” and “tolerance” so that no one anywhere ever has to feel a pang of bad feelings about themselves that we will get back to that Garden of Eden (Garden of Kumbaya, actually). Let’s be fair. Perhaps they are right, for although one can say that Christianity has produced a positive effect compared to other systems, no system has been fool-proof or provided a cure for man’s ills. But something tells me that embracing “Gaia” (or Marxism in its various guises) while killing the unborn in the millions will not get the job done.
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Post by timothylane on Dec 4, 2019 11:02:04 GMT -8
Well, I find the Durant explanation very thought-provoking. Certainly much in our past reflects our history. Even the northwestern Indians didn't always have abundance. It has been suggested that this is why the custom of potlatch developed. Most clans would have plenty, but a few would be unlucky (or something else, but one cannot control which stream has abundant salmon and which doesn't). So the successful would give them gifts one year, knowing it might be reversed another year. (Later the custom took a different turn, but apparently that's how it started out.)
As for origins, hominids left Africa early enough for Homo erectus to turn up in Java and China, not to mention the "hobbits" of Flores. The earliest human fossils in the Americas are only 20,000 or so years old the last I heard. Australia was also late to the party. Apparently at the height of an ice age it's possible to walk from eastern Siberia across to Alaska. Even at those times, the southern portions aren't entirely ice-bound during summer.
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Post by Brad Nelson on Dec 4, 2019 11:28:43 GMT -8
Actually, if warring tribes weren’t trying to move them out, the Pacific Northwest did have abundance. Shellfish, fish, seals, nuts, berries, deer, elk, and even whales were there for the relatively easy taking. Unlike the planes Indians, there is bounty nearly all-year round helped by relatively mild and short winters.
I don’t know all that much about their diet. And, of course, it would depend on what particular tribe in what particular area at what particular time. And I can tell you that living in the Pacific Northwest means dealing with a lot of rain, so it was no picnic. But if there was an idyllic Indian life, some of the tribes in the general area (Oregon, Washington, British Columbia) had it pretty good compared to most.
Still, no matter how good the diet, I would imagine infant mortality was high as it has been through most of history. But (again, I’m no expert) a lot of Native Americans in the region seemed to have the luxury of growing old. Perhaps many Native Americans (especially on the east coast) would have had it relatively easy if not for the savage tribes they had to deal with. It’s too bad, in retrospect, that we couldn’t all come together and distinguish between good Indians and bad Indians, good white settlers and bad white settlers.
I find the paper trail to be very thin. We see things “showing up,” indeed, But the rest is but a guess as to what started where and for how long. The plain fact is that the anthropologists are labeling various species (perhaps only with one bone in hand) as evolutionary ancestors of man. They are very probably simply separate species of ape. We have no unambiguous and clear transitional species. But there is plenty of guesswork.
Maybe Eden was in Africa. But given how glaciers have so changed the landscape in many places of the world, evidence of even older places that man inhabited may be all but wiped out. Plus, one should be very suspicious about the easy compliance by “science” that man came out of Africa. That smacks of political correctness.
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Post by Brad Nelson on Dec 4, 2019 11:43:04 GMT -8
One site says: I think salmon would have been the equivalent of our milk-and-bread. If you could live on just one thing, I think salmon had a lot going for it nutritionally. More info. This site notes: That really is almost a unique abundance. Other foods on their diet include crab, seaweed, clams, oysters, mussels, sea otters, turtles, mountain goat, bear, and there must have been more than a few plants they used in one way or another. It’s ironic that food now (for both Native Americans and Native Americans such as myself) is so abundant that many are eating worse than their forefathers. I'll have to see if I can find a good book on Northwest Native Americans and give it a read.
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