|
Post by timothylane on Nov 30, 2020 11:04:34 GMT -8
Interestingly, I just checked again and your posting wasn't there at all, nor was there any sort of reference to it being removed. I've seen this happen occasionally to mine when they in effect restart the comments column and drop the old ones, but that wasn't the case here.
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Nov 30, 2020 11:18:48 GMT -8
My position on Trump has always been that he’s a bum and a demagogue — but better than Hillary…or Biden. As a non-Christian the idea of a Messiah in politics is puzzling. For over 3000 years we Jews have seen a procession of self-proclaimed messiahs and have taken some of them gravely but not seriously. All of them have been flawed individuals with the normal failings of everyone else. There are no G-d like exceptions. Donald Trump is no different. He has a massive ego, and election in 2016 has only served to make the size of all outdoors. He has lied and cheated on his wives and made deals with unsavory people to keep his real estate business afloat. I don't think there is a commandment he has not shattered or at least given thought to breaking. But, I don't care if he is not a savior. I do care if he is effective. I don't care if he doesn't piously sit in the lotus position and paint his navel blue. I do care if he has leadership qualities. I don't care if he is an asshole. I do care that he has a vision for the country, and expressed in four easy to understand words. MAGA. I have worked for a number of employees who are no better and some who were worse. So, is Trump better than any democrat? Four years ago it was a crapshoot on which is worse Hillary or Trump, but Hillary was a known actor, especially in Arkansas. For a great many people it was ABH any body but Hillary. So we elected Trump on the basis of chance. And we were rewarded with radical changes from the communists who had taken over our government. Foreign policy that called China to task, reducing our military footprint in the ME and actual peace deals between Israel and the Arabs. An economy that prior to KFF was wizzing along at 3% unemployment. More conservative judges on the federal bench and thousands of mind-numbing regulations removed. Is Trump another Reagan? Not on your life, Reagan was the man we needed in 1980. Trump is the man we needed in 2016 and 2020. Neither was a messiah both are flawed, as we all are.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Nov 30, 2020 12:17:05 GMT -8
Here is an updated list of those exaggerated frauds which have been claimed.
I hereby declare that, just as the KFF panic was all based on science and above board with absolutely no ulterior motives, so it is with the 2020 presidential election. Nothing to see here, move on.
There is absolutely no such thing as election fraud or tampering with votes.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 11,060
Member is Online
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Nov 30, 2020 12:30:34 GMT -8
No one need wonder why I prefer to setup my own web site. Yeah, it’s gone. It’s like they came and took me in the middle of the night. Brad? Brad who? Never heard of him.
It was my opinion, of course. But I like to think that it was 100% unvarnished truth. And I’m quite used to that not making the cut.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Nov 30, 2020 12:33:17 GMT -8
I doubled checked and this is still the case. I read Brad's comment earlier and it certainly has disappeared now. Very strange.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 11,060
Member is Online
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Nov 30, 2020 12:33:31 GMT -8
Alas, that is way too big to fit on a bumper sticker.
|
|
|
Post by timothylane on Nov 30, 2020 12:44:29 GMT -8
Note that a Republican county discovered a counting error that gave Tenney 25 new votes (net) after the judge conveniently reported that the incumbent had won by 13. If this and IA 2 hold up, the GOP will have won 2 House seats by a combined 18 votes.
Incidentally, something like that is how the GOP dealt with Chicago in 1968. Daley was holding out over 200 precincts, so outstate Republicans kept out around 900 until Daley finally gave in. He did hold the Cook County Attorney position that year (defeating GOP incumbent Ben Adamowski in 1960 may actually have been Daley's goal in stuffing the ballot boxes). But the GOP won it in 1972, with baleful results for the Chicago machine (as Adamowski's election in 1956 had also eventually delivered).
Adamowski, incidentally, had been a member of the Daley machine until they let someone else win a race and he switched parties. His performance as County Attorney enabled him to win the GOP nod for Mayor in 1963, and he won a majority of white voters. Daley really wasn't happy that he depended on black votes to re-elect him.
|
|
|
Post by timothylane on Nov 30, 2020 13:08:54 GMT -8
I looked at Sharyl Attkison's article, and had some observations. First, she makes no evaluation of these claims, some of which seem dubious. For example, I gather that Pennsylvania sent 1.8 million ballots out in the primary and received 2.5 million in the general election, so there's no discrepancy.
On the other hand, the counts in which Trump lost votes are suspicious. If one assumes these were incorrect, the votes would come close to Trump's margin in both states, making the task a lot easier.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 11,060
Member is Online
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Nov 30, 2020 13:55:24 GMT -8
My advice is to separate the particular issue of Trump from voter fraud in general. Trump’s claims, as well as that of his lawyers, have been a joke. It’s even more so because Trump’s fragile ego was apparently bruised four years ago when he lost the popular vote and thus claimed that there were millions of fraudulent votes cast.
To my mind, Trump has skipped over to being “mental.” If he thought millions of votes were fraudulent 4 years ago, he should have done something. And what he and his lawyers have been doing so far in the very last minutes has been an embarrassing joke, and one that is likely going to work against doing something about voter fraud. This man-child has cried “wolf” too often.
That said, it’s long past time that the Republican Party stiffened it’s spine and went after what has increasing been seen as a civil right by the Stalinists. I just hope Trump’s crying wolf and myriad conspiracy theories (as well has the poor conduct of his legal team) don’t damage that cause.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Nov 30, 2020 14:21:28 GMT -8
That is my belief as well and why I have been so unyielding on this point. This is much bigger than Trump.
As long as I can remember, many parts, if not all of the USA electoral system have been run like a very corrupt third-world country. Even many third-world countries demand voter identification, yet the Demoncrats have been fighting this for decades. Other countries normally don't allow or are generally very careful about confirmation of mail-in ballots, yet the 2020 election in the USA has been a disaster in this regard. I never heard about dead people voting in any of the other countries I have lived in, yet it is a regular occurrence in the USA. I have never heard of observers being pushed out and excluded from viewing the vote count, but it is a regular occurrence in many large cities in the USA. I have never heard of the vote count stopping for a few hours and those in charge telling everyone to go home, and then go on counting without any supervision from the other side.
I could go on, and I don't find these things trivial. I am extremely happy that Trump is fighting this as it is showing the world some of the endemic corruption in our system. This needs to be unmasked. It is not Trump who might hurt our democracy, it is the bum politicians and bureaucrats who have been promoting or turning a blind eye to the filthy corruption which is spread throughout our system.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Nov 30, 2020 14:53:54 GMT -8
More important that the crimes I mentioned in my previous post are the constitutional travesties which abound.
How is it possible that it is legal for:
1. The Pennsylvania Governor/Secretary of State to issue a fiat which changes Pennsylvania law regarding when mail-in ballots may be counted? This was done, contested in court in Penn. and finally the Supreme Court received the case. It did not rule one way or the other and sent it back to Pennsylvania, with asshole Roberts basically saying the case was not yet ripe for judgment. Come back later. As Alito said, you are asking for chaos.
2. In several states across the country, the rules for sending out mail-in ballots be changed by governors and others by fiat and not in the legislature?
3. The rules for identifying/confirming mail-in ballots are genuine be changed in many states by fiat without the legislature voting on these?
The 2020 election was as rotten as they come. Whether Trump did something to stop this or not is less important than why didn't patriots across the country? Thank God I live in Texas where things are reasonably well run.
I have spoken with friends across the world and have mentioned a few of the many such "idiosyncrasies" in our system and they can't believe it. They all had the mistaken idea that America was a fair country where rules counted. I was sorry to disabuse them of their ideas.
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Nov 30, 2020 14:55:08 GMT -8
In 2016 Hillary lost. I don't recall any republicans lambasting Hillary supporters about being deplorable, losers and so on. However, democrats this year are aggressive in their attacks on republicans calling us losers, "one of those" and so on. I did take joy in Hillary's loss, but she is a politician and subject to all the venom required if she can not take --tough titty.
I believe this shows the divide happening in the nation. That we are living in two different worlds.
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Nov 30, 2020 15:01:21 GMT -8
As long as I can remember, many parts, if not all of the USA electoral system have been run like a very corrupt third-world country Alas, that is all to true and Texas is better but not exempt, remember landslide Lyndon ?
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Nov 30, 2020 15:09:16 GMT -8
That is why I used "reasonably." But Texas used to be much worse than it is today. At least this year, when I voted, I could see my paper ballot and make sure the names of those I voted for were on the paper.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 11,060
Member is Online
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Nov 30, 2020 16:08:57 GMT -8
Possibly because they wanted Biden to win and figured they could get away with extending their powers under the guise of accommodating the Wuhan Flu. I wonder if Trump hadn’t completely mentally caved to the Wuhan flu lockdown if he would have been in a better position to do something about this. After what I view as Trump’s meltdown over his own fraud claims (and the terribly, if not duplicitous, actions of his lawyers), I wonder if any Republican will want to do the heavy lifting of sorting through all this.
Right now, it’s difficult to distinguish between real concerns and conspiracy theories.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Nov 30, 2020 16:28:09 GMT -8
I disagree. The constitutional points I mentioned are not conspiracy theories. The legal cases brought by Lin Wood in Georgia and that brought by Congressman Kelly in Pennsylvania are not conspiracy theories. The way the numbers drastically changed the late night and early morning of the election day are not conspiracy theories. I watched and couldn't believe it was happening. I take that back. I could believe it was happening and it simply confirmed what I already knew, i.e. that the election was being rigged in some big Demoncrat cities. The way observers were kept out of the rooms or corralled on the opposite sides of rooms from where votes were being cast are not conspiracy theories. There are no doubt, a number of claims being bandied about that are not correct, but much of what is being reported is clearly fact.
Of course, I want Trump to win, but more important is to point out the fact that this election was dirty as Chicago sewage in the 1870s, in a number of places. Unless this is acknowledged, nothing can be done about it.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Nov 30, 2020 17:21:56 GMT -8
The most egregious instance of lawlessness is the case in Philadelphia where a Republican poll watcher was not allowed to view the vote count. He went to a judge and got a court order which instructed those at the counting center to let the poll watcher view the count. When the poll watcher tried to re-enter and view the count, a sheriff/police officer stopped him, read the court order and then told him that if he didn't leave the sheriff would arrest him.
I have heard no denial or rebuttal of this.
|
|
|
Post by timothylane on Nov 30, 2020 18:20:46 GMT -8
This is why I say that these illegal actions should lead to criminal charges. If we can't get rid of the fraudulent ballots because these Demagogue misdeeds mean we don't know which are fraudulent and which are legitimate, punishing the perpetrators will at least do something to deter future such fraudsters.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Dec 12, 2020 12:07:47 GMT -8
An interesting piece by Kotkin, who is more of a leftist than conservative.
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Dec 22, 2020 22:52:31 GMT -8
|
|