|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Jan 4, 2020 17:40:56 GMT -8
Absolutely no reason nor need to use nuclear weapons. I calculate that one run of about half the planes on a Ford-class carrier could completely destroy the Iranian economy. That's not counting the cruise missiles from one Burke-class destroyers.
Sorry about that link. I will try to fix it later.
|
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Jan 4, 2020 18:51:31 GMT -8
That's why we have an Air Force (and Navy and Marine air as well). Jane's has the US Air Force as the largest in the world. The second largest in the world is the US Navy/Marine air arm, and they fly off of carriers. It must be difficult for competing powers to contemplate the awesome power of our military and understand that the philosophy behind it is not imperial. One division, army or marine, can bring a world of hurt far beyond that of Iran or any other power. The same with one carrier strike group. In 2003 Bush went into Iraq with a force half the size his father sent in 1991 and they were not turned loose in a manner necessary to ensure total victory, remember "shock and awe"? The profit from Hawaii hollowed our forces out significantly but the last 3 years have brought new weapons and new skills to the battlefield. 17 years of combat, most of low intensity, have allowed our forces to gain competence and war fighting skills beyond those of our rivals. Americans are better armed, better trained, stronger, and more informed than any in the world. Realpolitik says don't mess with the US, something Iran, China and N Korea learned yesterday. |
|
|
|
Post by timothylane on Jan 5, 2020 8:35:58 GMT -8
Ted Cruz has proposed a Senate vote to approve of removing Soleimani from the world, patterned on the one unanimously adopted in 2011 approving of the similar removal of Osama. This should be a no-brainer given that Soleimani was as evil as Osama and even more dangerous. But so far no Demagogue has supported it, and I think no more than a handful will. (Even better, I doubt the Wicked Witch of the West will have the House vote on it at all.
A key element of everything inside the Beltway is the reporting. Cruz and the GOP must do everything they can to make the link between the two killings and force the synoptic media to cover it. One good way might be to include a reference back to the earlier vote (and its unanimity) in the introductory part of the final version of the resolution. The link is:
|
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Jan 5, 2020 14:19:18 GMT -8
|
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Jan 5, 2020 15:11:55 GMT -8
I thought the accurate translation was 72 raisins-----who knew?
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 12,243
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Jan 6, 2020 9:53:33 GMT -8
Yes. 72 virgins. A good one.
|
|
|
|
Post by timothylane on Jan 7, 2020 18:18:48 GMT -8
Iran has made a response, firing 15 missiles from their own country against Iraqi airbases at Al-Assad and Irbil (ancient Arbela, site of Alexander's final, decisive victory over Darius III of Persia), of which 4 exploded in flight. No one seems to have been hurt, and this was probably deliberate. Most likely the Iranians chose not to do enough damage to force Trump's hand. As one blogger opined, they blinked.
Not surprisingly, the Demagogues are doubling down on treason by blaming it all on Trump and ignoring all the prior Iranian attacks. "Treason against the United States shall consist only in levying War upon them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort." It looks like the Demagogues may be crossing the line from merely being anti-American to treason.
|
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Jan 7, 2020 20:45:03 GMT -8
This is why I said I wanted to wait and see how stupid the Iranians are. So far, they are not being stupid. I understand the bases at which the missiles were aimed do not have many Americans resident.
The missiles would seem to have been a somewhat tame display of power to convince their own people that they are not taking this laying down.
I know some people who are more afraid of an Iranian cyber attack than some other type of attack. I don't know enough about Iranian technical capabilities to gauge the danger of this.
I would not be surprised if the Iranians chose to hit some American ally (not Israel) sending the message that "you had better try and get your friend under control." It is doubtful, however, that anyone could control Trump in this matter.
Just after I wrote the above paragraph, I saw this article at the South China Morning Post
Although it is not yet clear what caused the crash, this is the type of stunt I expect the Iranians might pull.
|
|
|
|
Post by timothylane on Jan 7, 2020 21:06:40 GMT -8
They were just reporting massive cyber attacks in Texas. No way of knowing who's doing it, of course, but it's not hard to make a guess. Of course, we've done them a lot of harm by cyberwar (e.g., Stuxnet), and no doubt have more planned.
The Iranians apparently are claiming some kills in their propaganda for home consumption. How many people will believe it? That's their problem.
There have been large crowds of mourners at Soleimani's various funeral marches. Some of them probably were even sincere, though very plausible reports indicate that many people were ordered to mourn. There are also reports of large numbers of (mostly Sunni, probably) Muslims in the area cheering his death, but of course it's risky doing that not only in Iran but in its Iraqi and Syrian client states.
And the Babylon Bee reported the Demagogues as flying flags at half-mast (including many who bought flags solely so that they could do this) to mourn Soleimani's death. A CNN reporter complained that some people actually believed it and thus they only pretend to be a satire site. Of course, PBS took seriously Tina Fey's joke that (imitating Sarah Palin) she could see Russia from her home. (Palin actually said Russia could be seen from Alaska, which is true. This was an example of a governor trying to deal with the question of foreign policy and military policy inexperience.) Apparently there also sites dedicated to people who take stories in The Onion seriously.
Every article I get from Babylon Bee advertises itself as "fake news you trust delivered straight to your in-box" at the top, so they don't actually hide that their stories aren't true. The CNN reporter also turned out t to be a big fan of The Onion. Satire against conservatives is acceptable, but not against leftists. Of course, CNN is a favorite target of Babylon Bee. (They recently reported that CNN was going to spin off a site with real news instead of the usual propaganda. It's experimental, since their audience seems to have no desire for truth.)
Early reports are that the Ukrainian liner had an accident. It was flying the risk Boeing 737. In addition, there are reports of a small earthquake at or near an Iranian nuclear facility. It's thought to have been naturally caused.
|
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Jan 7, 2020 21:32:11 GMT -8
If B-2s left MO this evening than they will be on station about 08:00 Wed. A coordinated strike with F-22s B-52s, A-10s and, and F-35 could hit the Iranian oil depots within an hour of the B2 arrival. SHOCK AND AWE!!
Trump has schuleded an announcement about the missile attack Wednesday morning. If there is to be a strike it will coincide with his announcement.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 12,243
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Jan 7, 2020 21:47:50 GMT -8
That should be an interesting press conference.
|
|
|
|
Post by kungfuzu on Jan 7, 2020 21:59:46 GMT -8
It is interesting to note that at least 6 x B-52s flew to Diego Garcia almost 48 hours ago.
I tend to agree with those who say Trump should opt to destroy the Iranian Navy first or at least in tandem with any other strike. The Strait of Hormuz needs to be kept clear, and more importantly seen to be kept clear, to keep oil from going through the roof.
|
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Jan 7, 2020 22:25:44 GMT -8
It should come as no surprise, but it does bewilder, that so many "experts" are predicting the end of the world if we just kick the shit out of Iran. These are the same "experts" that predicted thousands of body bags before the first gulf war. National Interest magazine has been talking disaster for years if we just make them mad. I suppose they think, if I'm wrong no one will care or remember, but if I predict an easy victory and I'm wrong than I am a goat.
Few commentators want to go out on a limb and tell even a measure of truth. Even with the reduced state of our military from 2008-2016 we could defeat Iran, what was missing was a spine, the profit from Hawaii does not have one. He was a jellyfish, floating along, stinging and killing when he could just drifting with the current. Our enemies are used to the jellyfish, congress and the media are full of them, DJT is a wolf and it is a time of wolfs.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 12,243
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Jan 8, 2020 8:11:24 GMT -8
This international Dhimmitude of most of the press is remarkable. Thus it’s no surprise (although it drives me nuts) when watching a Libflix series such as “Messiah” where the “Messiah” announces that the path to world peace is withdrawal of all American troops from overseas.
The pre-talk about the upcoming (soon?) news conference is that Trump will deescalate because no Americans were killed. But who knows?
|
|
|
|
Post by artraveler on Jan 8, 2020 8:12:18 GMT -8
It appears that Iran has chosen to be viewed as incompetent rather than stupid, Ptrsident to speak soon.
Dow up 70, new records in the markets
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 12,243
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Jan 8, 2020 8:15:08 GMT -8
The thoughts I heard on this morning's news, Artler, is that Iran did this on purpose in order to retaliated but not too much. That sounds plausible. But apparently four of the missiles malfunctioned so your point stands.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 12,243
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Jan 8, 2020 8:16:09 GMT -8
But Apple is down just a smidgen. Breaks my heart.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 12,243
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Jan 8, 2020 8:41:04 GMT -8
It was an excellent, clarifying speech by Trump. I especially liked how he hung around the neck of the anti-America president, Obama, the cost of those Iranian missiles paid for by his clearly anti-American deal with Iran.
I like how he clarified things. He didn’t need any double-talk. There’s no way a Democrat could have given anything but a muddle because they are anti-American to begin with. They would have to jump through continuous loops of pretzel logic.
One also gets the sense that the next time an American is killed, Iran is going to find itself on the end of a large missile strike. I also like how Trump called on the wimpy NATA allies to toe the line.
|
|
Brad Nelson
Administrator
עַבְדְּךָ֔ אֶת־ הַתְּשׁוּעָ֥ה הַגְּדֹלָ֖ה הַזֹּ֑את
Posts: 12,243
|
Post by Brad Nelson on Jan 8, 2020 8:55:29 GMT -8
One commenter of this Fox News article says: Yikes. I had heard about that. Shouting “Death to America” does entail some risks. One guy has a similar thought: “Chess 101. Iran attacks again and he’s free to go Full Monty.”
Like this comment as well:
And... |
|
|
|
Post by timothylane on Jan 8, 2020 9:24:42 GMT -8
Apparently Trump is giving Iran a chance to accept their show retaliation, in which case we have no need to do anything further. Since the two bases are actually Iraqi bases with an American presence, and they didn't hurt any of our people, this was really an attack on Iraq as much as on us. It will be interesting to see if the caretaker PM and the Shite legislators can muster the courage to talk back to their master. I wouldn't bet on it.
I may have to disagree with the conclusion that the Black God never did anything to Iran because of his lack of a backbone. He certainly had no backbone when dealing with foreign enemies, such as Iran. But there was the matter of a shared hatred of Western civilization (especially the USA and Israel). And his overriding foreign goal was to align us with Iran, and never mind the "Death to America!" chants.
|
|
